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DITW 12-9: Terza Rima

🕑 Added 2023-12-01 20:03:40 +0000 UTC

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Bill F Protagoras

In Temptations Kimmy Waters asks herself what seems to me to remain a pertinent question about Devlin's persistence in his pursuit of her... "if sex was only a piece of the puzzle, what was the whole picture"? We have ideas about what other people think he wants... yet does he really have only the basest, or shallowest motivations, as his conversation and actions appear to disclose? I mean to say what is he up to?

Bill F Protagoras

As the incomparable Alfred Bester put it in "The Demolished Man"... 'Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun.'

Bill F Protagoras

A morality tale, CSH, exactly!

Bill F Protagoras

How could it be any clearer... throughout this novel a married couple has been at the beck and call of a powerful man who sits behind a desk and smiles insincerely whilst stroking a pussy... if you really need a bad guy...

Bill F Protagoras

In fact, Mike, we later discover that Devlin claimed a habitation in both their minds during their school days. We see this in flashbacks that show he already had his foot firmly wedged in the doors of both their perceptions... Devlin wasn't just some guy with a sizeable tent in his pants who just caught closet slut Kimmy's eye... most of the women, and men at the party, considered Devlin to have been, for good or ill a big deal in high school. Devlin (already born into privilege) clearly cultivated his image and hyped his game at that time. We might not have had a view inside him, but we know what he wants people to believe about him, and undesirable aspects of his personality he is incapable of hiding. Kimmy may have had urges... but the D pushed, cajoled and conned her into being his victim... albeit a 'willing' victim. There is a reason why there is much more legislation to prevent the abusive power dynamics in most walks of life recently... All power corrupts, and intimidates... droit du seigneur is not a myth. And university professors... even of history are hardly reliable when they bandy terms like "credible accounts".

Bill F Protagoras

He also wrote about freedom of speech and printing during the Civil War in the Areopagitica... the man had a pair confronting Parlamentarian censorship... but he hadn't yet developed the knack for snappy titles like Samson Agonistes, or his great hit Paradise Lost and its somewhat less successful spin off Paradise Regained. The American Colonies boast of liberating themselves from the King of England because of unjust taxation whilst the English Revolutionaries for a similar reason took the more drastic measure of chopping off their King's head and making the monarchies of Europe a bit more insecure about Divine Right and encouraging the change to Despotism Light... I apologise, I will never do this again.

Bill F Protagoras

Also, with so many gagging for it, I'm not so sure KT is going to serve it up to us on a plate just like that. I think it's safe to say, she has been known to dabble in (literary) pain mistressry. And isn't there some kind of Trocchian Glaswegian connection through her fictional acquaintance Amy? Isn't Kimmy wrestling with her better angels?

Bill F Protagoras

I think relations are too strained for it to be that uncomplicated, Tracy. I want it all... what you want, but no waiting outside the door... The devil is, after all, in the details... that, amongst other things, is why we require KT's superlative skills.

Bill F Protagoras

Hot wife carries much more caché than hot husband, and in word association what follows "bull..." ?

Bill F Protagoras

Kimmy as rebel angel... I like that! Elvis just repeating "Yes, you are!" doesn't sway my opinion as much as Milton empathizing with the enemy of his beloved God!

Bill F Protagoras

Evil Kimmy, I like that! "Evil, be thou my Good: by thee at least Divided empire with Heaven’s King I hold,"

Bill F Protagoras

Not blaming her gender, Mike... blaming 'her' because of her gender... Why won't she just do badly paid, or unpaid work, so we can maintain profit margins... and keep evil socialism at bay! We are happy for her to indulge in any sexual activities we want! We do the demanding and she supplies the dirty work, ain't that right, Dev ? Wink! Wink! Nudge! Nudge! Nod! Nod! Trickle down theory... Know what I mean, guvnor?

Bill F Protagoras

"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to yield to it. Resist it, and your soul grows sick with longing for the things it has forbidden to itself, with desire for what its monstrous laws have made monstrous and unlawful." Me and Oscar are getting that put on T- shirts to be on sale on the picket line outside Stone's Brokerage... all proceeds going to Charity. Not tax deductible! Kim-mee! Kim-mee! Thrust that banner high, Josh!

Bill F Protagoras

“I can resist anything except temptation.”

Tracey52

While I think I know what’s coming in the next chapter - Devlin rocking Kimmy’s world while Josh watches, I’d be happy to skip that and start with Josh outside the room back against the door, listening to them and having seen or gotten what he wanted to make his decision. That’s what i want to get to.

Mike Monroe

Love the debate and discussion..that is the masterpiece in writing that KT gives us...In my opinion Kimmy is the villain because she is just that. Had the situation been reversed and Josh started getting with Amy and doing all these things with Amy behind Kimmy's back then he would be the villain. Josh didn't start this . Kimmy did with her actions that is just truth has nothing to do with blaming her gender. Women are not always the bad girl in this ..nor are the innocent either. Devlin is who his is and there will not be anything excuse his behavior. He means no good for anyone especially Josh! This whole story began because of Kimmys actions from bk 1 to Bk 10...This is just a story of chickens coming home to roost. Begining of the end of all relationships as they were!

Bill F Protagoras

For those who don't know 'steady as she lies' means keep the vessel on this course (more or less) a double meaning without being a rude double entendre...

Bill F Protagoras

And everyone becomes incontinent at a mere glimpse of the comfy chair

CSH

Well nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.

Bill F Protagoras

My intention was to whet everybody's appetite for the next mind mangling instalment... and warn everyone to stock up on tissues or whatever. Like a blurb but not without a grain of truth.

Bill F Protagoras

I agree, Mike, Josh is not a cucky stereotype, but he is a strong person who, in my reading of this work, makes pragmatic decisions to achieve his goals. The mistakes that Kimmy has made seem to be swaddling him and believing he needs taking care of. Devlin despises (fears?) him, Kimmy underestimates him, but he is no more vulnerable than they. But Kimmy overestimates her own power over Josh, he doesn't need coddling. Also in Britain and Spain, in my experience most people think lying is par for the course, and those who do not are the biggest liars. What's the big deal, Kimmy thought 'what Josh didn't know wouldn't hurt him'. Self-serving perhaps... Extremely naive, but the two of them are hardly out of nappies... And Devlin thinks that if heaven exists the steps that lead up to it may as well be carpeted with other peoples' happiness... or their faces? Kimmy just wanted a good hard multi-orgasmic shag... and definitely did not expect the Spanish Inquisition to visit the environs of Toronto on her account.

Bill F Protagoras

I agree, however, where Josh is concerned people seem to conflate the different roles he plays in different situations with weakness, but I see them as intelligent coping strategies... especially against one with such obvious advantages as are equated with power. There is puritanism and the cult of masculinity at play as well as apologist patriarchal political ploys to infantilise women while demanding greater ethical rectitude. For me, morals just parade around as ethics, without accountability. Devlin is blameworthy for much more than a sexual & emotional entanglement, and his rationalised bullying and unwarranted sense of superiority are clear indicators that this is so. Devlin is a danger to the environment he inhabits and humanist behaviour in general.

CSH

Yes, I think the whole thing gets cast as a morality tale but I can’t see it that way. Each of the main characters has tried to turn this situation to their own advantage. Josh included. I like to think I’ve respected Josh as a character by holding him to the same standard as Kimmy. I believe that in his own way he is as manipulative as Kimmy. Kimmy lied constantly but he wanted her to lie so he could continue in his game.

Rocambole50

IMHO there is some hidden misogynism or at least genre stereotyping in the comments blaming Kimmy. The woman should be the one refraining her non-espouse desires while it is assumed that we must be indulgent with men doing the same. Josh is sexually stimulated by masochism and humiliation. The fact that he is so innocent and passive that he did not know until Devlin and Kimmy showed him, does not make him innocent. And now that we are speaking about blame, I want to say that the three of them are consenting adults and whatever does each of them must be blamed to him/her. Each of them has psychological particularities but we cannot blame Devlin for being dominant while excusing Josh for being submissive. In fact, in real life, Devlin would be universally congratulated while Josh would be despised. But I understand people here are mostly well hearted and in this context take sides with the weak is a good moral guideline. So my abstract is that to blame Kimmy is misogynist but to blame Devlin reveals good moral foundations.

Mike Monroe

Kimmy is most definitely the Devil in disguise!!! Prior to the Reunion in the park ..He was not a part of there lives. Kimmy has continued to bring him in their world. She is responsible for him staying in their lives period. Yes has Josh now intertwined himself in her mess with Devlin ..Yes but this has been Kimmy's doing...Josh could have been just fine without all these shenanigans in his life. It wasn't a fantasy he had and asked for like most of the husbands in most stories.

Bill F Protagoras

Not EVERY minute... he protested... probably in vain.

Bill F Protagoras

A lot of the gang seem to view Kimmy as the devil in disguise (from the song) but Stone jr actually offered both the Waters, each, their individual diabolical deal that one way or another has caused dissension between them... using the deals like shims as KT/Kimmy observed to cleave the couple apart when now they most need to cleave together... and now along comes Devlin brandishing his priapic plough... intent on a hellish harrowing... to seed even greater discord! Is the devil going to take the hindmost? Are we going to enjoy every minute? A thorny question...

Bill F Protagoras

I'm glad some one appreciates my obscure maritime observations...

Bill F Protagoras

Of course terza rima is used in the first two stanzas of the sonnet form so Dante had to come before Petrarch, just as Kimmy's cheating had to come before Josh's "kink" developed Rereading (yet again) the first two books makes this patently obvious. It's also cute to see little Kimmy learning to cuckold with training wheels on the bike she's clearly never going to forget how to ride!

Bill F Protagoras

Oh,KT I found the paragraph I mentioned where I thought you kinda referenced another author, it's in Temptations in Meanings... it's like William Burrough's aleatory cut-up technique, although the narration is about Kimmy, it almost seems like an alternative plot has been inserted. It's the second paragraph when Kimmy is awake while Josh sleeps (?) after their hat-trick pervy fuck fest. The metaphor implies Kimmy's involvement in paranoid Burrough's type government conspiracy (without mugwumps, heroin or suicidal hanged young boys in their death throes ejaculating into writhing sadistic women)... and Josh is excluded... even targeted, it's very telling, a bit like Josh's fever dream, but it would have to be lucid dreaming because, apart from the strangely specific metaphor, Kimmy's thought processes seem clear and well reasoned. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it. You needn't reply as I imagine you are immersed in work and I have a vested interest in not distracting you from your extremely fruitful, no doubt soon to be harrowing, labours. Thank you! PS It is also curious how Josh(ua) (which is cognate with Jesus) is referred to as the adversary, when that (old)nick name usually pertains to the devil!

Bill F Protagoras

Actually Milton was a hack... he was hired by parliament to defend them against Erasmus's accusations of regicide. I love ole John though, he wrote one of my favourite lines in English poetry... They also serve who only stand and wait... Being blind,his contribution to the Revolutionary cause was more limited than other jealous mean spirited clods would have wanted. It comes from "When I Consider How My Light Is Spent." Your own painstaking felicitous phrasing summons up those of its kind...

Bill F Protagoras

You use a cerebral team of toreros and picadores to focus the spectators' attention on the part of the plaza de toros where you want it to be... just as they also lead their bull on a merry dance... to wear it down to despatch it with the coup de grâce. The reader is the bull, as well as the vouyeurs, in this case... and maybe Devlin is too... if you so decide...

Bill F Protagoras

This instalment also contains another intriguing authorial sentence... just resting there like a caltrop...

Bill F Protagoras

It actually means "Abandon any hope, and mind your head as you enter" ... It inspired the warning signs on underground trains all over the world... There's actually a sign on the way out of hell but what it says is not widely know...

Bill F Protagoras

Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate... timely point... so I thought I'd nail it to your post... as you brought it up...

Bill F Protagoras

This was for Rocambole50 but I'm an inept clod... when the fuck will I get the hang of this new steam power !?

Bill F Protagoras

Well, not brilliant KT... not dazzling, not refulgent... BUT JUST FUCKING LAMBENTLY DARKNESS VISIBLE... as some old hack wrote on one of his Hellmark greetings cards, or was it congratulatory? Me... Exit pursued by a bear.

Bill F Protagoras

Nastily put... but fair is foul... thanksgiving fare...

Bill F Protagoras

Rocky... not done... after all remember the old refrain... the enemy of my enemy is my spouse...

Bill F Protagoras

Naaah... everything's just fine.

Bill F Protagoras

I don't know Kat it all depends on our beloved protagonists' intentions and how much infernal roadwork is overdue... Kimmy is a wild card and Josh a moody grown up enigma... (as he's always been to my mind).

Bill F Protagoras

I think so too... Kimmy doesn't look to be a happy romper... too many balls... not enough air...

Bill F Protagoras

And a bit Heart of Darknessy or the end of the Great Gatsby. Luv it!

Bill F Protagoras

It's left me with the metallic taste of blood in my mouth... but something tells me that's not gonna be the only bodily fluid on the menu... steady as she lies Josh...

CSH

The “pretend” line was devastating.

CSH

It’s there now.

CSH

I think they will make it out the door together but if we take Wes’s comment metaphorically then, yes, it may be where they are headed.

Tracey52

We can only hope

Kat

I liked that part, too, how he was so cold and unemotional about it. I’ve never been so invested in two fictional characters before! This is going to be so painful to read, because you know Josh is going to lose his mind, but I can’t wait for the next chapter. I hope it’s soon! I like when KT throws us a surprise! Lol

Andrew Mellein

I cant stop thinking about these characters!!! (LOL) It seems like Josh in this chapter is broken and DGIF about Kimmy at this point! He's at the end of his rope and just wants some validation of Kimmy's affair! The “Then pretend” line was gold! I'm going to be constantly coming back to the paetron for the next chapter (LOL)!!!

Kat

Me too, Andrew. I’m dying for the next chapter.

Kat

Those are some good what ifs. It seems like Kimmy isn’t that excited to do this, now that Josh is there to watch. He and Devlin have taken the fun out of it for her. Plus, Devlin is going to dominate both of them. Kimmy is turned on when she is the only one dominating Josh. Their marriage does look pretty much done here.

Andrew Mellein

Helluva chapter KT! I love how Kimmy is finally stuck in a trap of her own making. Kimmy should have just told the truth to Josh. Now she is stuck in a bigger mess. I predicted Josh and Devlin would form some sort of alliance. Albeit one with both having with their own motivations. I don't think Kimmy can lie her way through this! KT's writing is once again superb. I love how she ties back to Kimmy saying "No Kissing" which Kimmy said to Devlin at the beginning of their affair and then into the heart of their affair Kimmy completely disregard it and was kissing Devlin. This highlights the idea that good Kimmy is trying to bury and suppress the evil seductive Kimmy. I don't think good Kimmy is going to last long with Devlin. But that's what Josh wants to witness. I cant wait for the next chapter KT! Hopefully sooner rather than later. I think about these characters all the time!

Kat

I see this as a realistic conclusion to their time in the hotel. There’s no way Josh will be able to look at her after he sees her go crazy for Devlin. She’s going to try and perform for him, but her body will betray her.

Donkatsu

In papillas veritas. History does not repeat itself, but sometimes it rhymes. This is a fantastic setup, KT. Who leaves that hotel room in one piece?

Wess

Finally posted and I get the dreaded something went wrong message.

Wess

Oh this is just delicious. Devlin pushing all of Kimmy's buttons - Bringing her to multiple orgasms. Totally under his control. And Kimmy is at his mercy, unable to resist the best sex she's ever had, on complete display for Josh. And there's nothing she can do to ameliorate her euphoria. She will subjugate herself all the while soaking up Josh's complete humiliation. And after the final orgasm… she hears the door click. Josh has left the building.

CSH

How about some what ifs? What if Kimmy now likes this less than Josh? Wouldn’t that be ironic? I mean she pretended to be doing stuff for Josh the whole time and she secretly loved it. Now she really is doing it for him and she kind of hates it. What if Josh wants to continue, insists to do this again, and Kimmy mentally hates it but can’t resist it. Isn’t that a bit like hell for both of them? Does she maybe come to actually resent Josh and maybe hate him a little for making her do it? What if he then says, “okay that’s enough” at some point but now she’s no longer inclined to stop? I’ve never read a better scene as a set up. It’s so real it is a bit disturbing. Also I loved the “no kissing” part as it paralleled her first encounter with Devlin where she tried to go that route. It didn’t last then and we know it won’t last here either. Honestly, in this scene, their marriage looks dead. Its future, if there is one, will likely be determined by what happens when they get home.

CSH

Interesting and profound.

CSH

There’s definitely something more. A lot more… but what exactly?

Rocambole50

When you sail at night to open sea, the lights of the villages at the shore fade and fade. At some point you stop looking in that direction because the absence of the lights is more frightening than just look ahead to where always there have been darkness.

Tracey52

Love to know what Josh is thinking and planning. What he hopes to get from this? Great writing kt.

Mike Monroe

So here we are at the beginning of Dante inferno. No one will leave here unscathed. Josh will never be the same ...I agree Devlin and Kimmy have been his bully for well at least 10 ..book 11 really didn't have anything of note happen between Kimmy and Devlin. So here comes be careful what you ask for! This is a very stupid thing Josh is allowing. He should just turn and run to the nearest divorce attorney and be done with Kimmy lying..cheating no good behind...I am not still convinced this is what Josh wants down deep The tent thing I don't believe happened like that. We have to wait and see..but this a very big mistake Josh has made.

Bill F Protagoras

Yep! Another bow to Dante... I had to check though, thought it might be Petrarch... but it was Petrarch's turn to be the dwarf standing on Dante's shoulders. But they can't take the sonnet off him... probably.

JL23

Seeing only Kimmy’s perspective definitely ups the drama. It feels like her read on Josh could be completely accurate. I could envision him making the mental justifications she’s envisioning here. But this also feels like the best possible outcome for her now, so of course she’s desperately hoping it’s the truth. But there is so much of Josh’s perspective we’ve be kept out of the loop on, especially his interactions with Devlin, that it feels like there’s more here. I don’t think it’s as simple as Kimmy bangs Devlin and her and Josh can move on with all that’s unsaid forgiven and forgotten. That feels like too neat an ending. The tension is what exactly are the additional parts of Josh’s plan. Is there something that Kimmy (and even Devlin) aren’t expecting? I’d honestly be disappointed if there isn’t.

BGPitt

This is getting hot again now, maybe everybody gets what they want, so exciting...

Bill F Protagoras

Devlin... truth! Allegedly!

Bill F Protagoras

Ook! (Mick Jagger, but bulkier and more pretentious... and Carly Simon wasn't available).

Kat

I also love that this whole scene in the hotel has been in Kimmy’s POV. Her body is definitely going to betray her, but I think when it’s over there won’t be the charged glow up she got from it before, or that she got from Hyun. She’s putting on a performance, for sure, but her audience might not come back to watch her again. There is so much omnious tension here.

Bill F Protagoras

Mean kids... Uh,huh!

L_S87

That's a great point about the bullying, because that's exactly what ther comment was meant to emphasize. The two of them working together to torment and bully Josh because they *both* love it. It's one of the defining traits they share. Difference being what Kimmy pointed out, also truthfully. Devlin does it to hurt, Kimmy doesn't. Not really. She does it because it makes her feel good and doesn't feel like she's doing it at Josh's expense. Or at least never intended to. Which is why this is twisting her up so much. I think she saw what her and Devlin did as something separate. Josh was involved but ancillary. Not meant to be front and center. Protected as Kimmy states. The truth of what Kimmy and Devlin did was for her, the game was for Josh. And she tried to keep them separated as a buffer so she could have her cake and eat it too. This new thing is dangerous. She can't say what Devlin likes, what she likes, because the audience will hate her for it.

Bill F Protagoras

I will say nothing, but hold my breath and wait... because evolution can bring survival by the most crooked back roads... and only deluded social Darwinists like Devlin think it's earned like a phony merit badge... I need to relax and sneak back and read it again when I've taken the edge off with a calming cup of tea... it's a bit like being on a desert island dressed in a suit made of leaves like a bit of a prat, when you see a print in the damp sand and a disembodied voice tells you not to think but just to say the first thing that comes to mind... and an infinite number of monkeys, no they're chimps, stare expectantly, their hairy knuckled hands hovering over all those keyboards and all you can say is... Ook!

Kat

I wonder how this is going to go. Kimmy seems borderline vicious in her hate for Devlin. We all think Kimmy’s going to go wild and eventually lose control with Devlin, but she didn’t really hate him before when they were having the affair. She only started loathing him, and being repulsed by him after he messed things up with Josh. She enjoyed being with him before. She loved the sex, loved sneaking around, loved the luxuries, etc. She even told Devlin how upset she was that he wrecked a good thing with her exposing it to Josh. I’m not seeing this Kimmy here. I’m seeing real hatred for Devlin right now, and real pain in Kimmy. She’s wounded when Josh tells her cold and unemotionally to pretend to want Devlin. She’s afraid that this moment might be the one where she loses everything. Should have thought about that before, girl. She only fantasized Josh being in the room with her and Devlin. And when she played their game, she was the dominant one, she was the one in charge. Here it’s going to be a lot different. Josh has never seen her be so submissive to Devlin. Devlin’s already being a taunting jackass and they’ve barely begun. I wish he’d elaborate more out loud on what he’s done with Kimmy, starting with the party. I think the only one who actually uttered any truth here was Devlin, when he said he and Kimmy were just two mean kids pushing Josh around and having the time of their lives doing it. For many of the books, Josh was tortured and tormented, while his wife and her lover took great pleasure in mocking him behind his back. Kimmy loved every minute of it. Josh knows Kimmy is also his bully, too. I wish Josh would just walk out the door and never look back!

L_S87

Holy shit, KT. This is like going to a 5 star restaurant, expecting a 5 star meal and getting something completely unexpected. A feast reserved for royalty in the VIP room. So much better than one could ever imagine. Amazing. And I love that you're keeping this, at least so far, in Kimmy's perspective so we're left with the same wash of uncertainty that she has. No idea what Josh is thinking, no idea what he's said to Devlin, what information that Devlin has divulged that has lead to this. Spectacular. One thing is certain, no matter how reluctant Kimmy portrays herself to be, her body doesn't lie. She gives Devlin a hard time, makes this difficult, but it's a show for Josh. Also for herself because she IS hacked off at this asshole for leading them to this point. Yet. She still wants it. And that's the truth Josh is looking for. I just don't think he's going to like all the strings that come with this "enlightenment" he's about to receive. Kimmy knows, that's why she's acting how she is. This is a performance. Grand theater. And if she fails it, she loses everything.


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